Let me tell you a story.
Back in the mid-2000s, I was in a hyper-competitive suburban market where inventory was tight and buyers were picky. I had just lost out on two listings in a row to agents who had bigger teams and deeper marketing budgets. I was frustrated—and honestly, a little burned out. Then I stumbled onto a goldmine: expired listings.
I still remember the first one I landed. It was a three-bedroom ranch that had sat stale for 90 days with another agent who’d slapped it on the MLS and prayed. I reached out with a personalized letter (yes, handwritten), followed up with a phone call the next day, and met the seller by week’s end. Within 30 days, that house was sold—at full asking. That deal led to two referrals, and one of those turned into a $1.2M listing the following spring.
That’s when it clicked: expired listings aren’t dead ends—they’re untapped opportunities. These are sellers who’ve already raised their hand. They wanted to sell. They just didn’t have the right strategy—or the right agent.
In this guide, I’m going to show you exactly how to find expired listings, what to say when you reach out, how to win the listing presentation, and how to turn expireds into a consistent, scalable part of your real estate business.
I’m not just sharing theory here. This is the exact approach I’ve used (and taught dozens of agents to use) to generate steady listings—even in slow markets. No fluff. Just strategy, scripts, and real talk.
Let’s get into it.
Why Most Agents Fail With Expired Listings (And How You’ll Win Instead)
Let’s be honest—most agents completely blow it with expired listings.
They either come in too aggressive, sounding like telemarketers desperate for a deal…
Or they send some cookie-cutter postcard that screams, “I’m just like the last guy who couldn’t sell your home.”
Here’s what I learned after working dozens of expireds: It’s not just about being first. It’s about being different.
In my early days, I made the same mistakes. I’d pull the MLS at 7 a.m., hammer the phone for two hours, and blast out the same old “Your home didn’t sell, but I can help” script. Crickets.
Then I changed my approach.
Instead of selling, I started asking questions:
- “What was the #1 thing you felt your last agent could’ve done better?”
- “If the perfect buyer walked through the door tomorrow, where are you moving next?”
- “Do you still want to sell, or are you just burned out from the process?”
And that changed everything. Because now I wasn’t pitching—I was positioning myself as the solution to a real problem.
Here’s the key: expired listings are about trust recovery, not salesmanship.
These homeowners already took a leap—and got burned. Your job is to understand where the last agent dropped the ball, and show—in very real, tangible ways—how you’ll do it differently.
What Winning Expired Listings Can Do for Your Business (It’s Bigger Than You Think)
Here’s the part no one talks about: mastering expired listings isn’t just about getting more deals—it’s about transforming your business model.
Think about it. Most agents grind through open houses, buyer showings, internet leads, and social media content hoping something sticks. But expireds? They’re already motivated. They’ve already mentally moved out. All they need is someone who can close the loop.
When I made expired listings a pillar of my business, here’s what changed:
More Listings, Less Chasing
Listings are leverage. With expireds, I started controlling inventory instead of chasing it. That meant sign calls, open house traffic, and seller referrals—all from one core strategy.
Faster Deal Cycles
These aren’t “just browsing” leads. These are people who have already had their home on the market. Many are ready to re-list within days or weeks. One of my best years came from a 90-day sprint where I focused solely on expireds. I listed 11 homes in one quarter—9 of them closed within 75 days.
Built-in Trust (When You Do It Right)
Ironically, expired sellers want to believe in agents—they just don’t want to get burned again. When you show up with empathy, insight, and a real plan, you instantly differentiate yourself. That creates trust—and trust leads to loyalty, referrals, and repeat business.
Market-Proof Strategy
When the market slows down and inventory rises, expired listings spike. Most agents panic. You won’t. Because while they’re wondering where their next deal is coming from, you’ll be doubling down on one of the highest-intent sources of listings in the business.
Expired listings gave me predictability. Control. Growth.
And if you do this right, they’ll do the same for you.
How to Actually Find (and Qualify) the Right Expired Listings
Let’s get something straight: not all expired listings are worth your time.
If you’re spending hours chasing homes that were overpriced disasters or dealing with sellers who have zero motivation to try again, you’ll burn out fast. The key is to cherry-pick—and I mean that literally.
Here’s my system, step by step.
How to Actually Find and Qualify the Right Expired Listings (Without Wasting Time or Burning Out)
When agents think about expired listings, the first reaction is usually excitement—“They already wanted to sell!”—followed closely by frustration: “Why won’t any of them call me back?”
Here’s the truth: chasing every expired is a rookie move. It’s how you end up burned out, broke, and wondering if this strategy even works.
But if you take a surgical approach—filtering for motivation, timing, price alignment, and listing history—you’ll build a pipeline of high-quality seller leads that convert.
Let’s break this down into two phases:
Phase 1: Where and How to Find Expired Listings
Most agents rely too heavily on the MLS and call it a day. That’s a mistake. If you want consistent, high-converting expired leads, you need to work across multiple channels. Here’s a table breaking down each source:
Source | Pros | Cons | Best For |
MLS Hot Sheets | Immediate, accurate, localized data. Set filters by zip, price, days. | Manual effort required. No contact info. | Day-one expireds within your farm area. |
Redx / Vulcan7 | Delivers full data: names, phone, email, past agents. Auto-dials. | Monthly subscription. Competition is high on same-day leads. | High-volume prospecting. Great for scripts + tracking. |
Espresso Agent | Clean interface, integrates with CRMs, excellent for follow-up. | Costly if you’re not consistent. | Agents focused on long-term nurture. |
Title Reps | Can pull historical expireds by criteria: zip, price, timeframe. | Requires relationship-building. Manual outreach needed. | Off-market expireds (30–180 days) that aren’t bombarded. |
County Tax Records | Pure DIY. Excellent for off-market or unlisted sellers. | Time-consuming. No automation. No phone/email unless you dig. | Deep research. Higher quality, but slow output. |
FSBO & Withdrawn Lists | Sellers on the edge. Often overlap with expired motivations. | Not technically expireds. Varying intent levels. | Supplementary source when inventory is tight. |
When you know how to use each of these sources properly, you’ll stop wasting time chasing low-probability leads—and start building a reliable system for expireds that feeds your business year-round.
Let’s break them down one by one.
MLS Hot Sheets (The Foundation)
What it is:
Your local MLS allows you to set up “hot sheets”—daily alerts for expired, canceled, withdrawn, or re-listed properties based on specific criteria (zip code, price range, days on market).
Common Mistake:
Most agents just scan the daily expired list and start calling. That’s reactive. You need to go one layer deeper.
Insider Tips:
- Set multiple alerts by zip code or farm area so you can react hyper-local.
Example: I had separate alerts for homes $400K–$600K in two specific school districts. That alone doubled my appointment rate.
- Compare DOM (Days on Market) vs. average DOM in that area. If the listing sat way longer, it’s a clue there was poor pricing, marketing, or motivation—all good entry points in your pitch.
- Check for pattern failures. I’d routinely find listings that failed every spring because the seller refused to stage. If I spotted that pattern, I’d tailor my pitch: “Every time this home hits the market in spring, it lingers. Let me show you why.”
Out-of-the-Box Strategy:
Pull “near-expireds”—homes that are about to hit expiration in 7–10 days. Reach out before anyone else and offer to step in before they pull the plug. It’s a proactive move that positions you as a solution, not just another agent calling after the failure.
Redx / Vulcan7 (High-Speed, High-Competition Lead Engines)
What it is:
These platforms aggregate expired listing data, append contact information (phone numbers, emails), and often include dialers and basic CRMs.
Common Mistake:
Agents use the default script, blast through calls, and wonder why no one responds. If your outreach sounds like everyone else’s, you’re invisible.
Insider Tips:
- Customize your filters. Don’t just grab every expired lead. Segment by price, city, or DOM to focus on your ideal client.
- Use tagging religiously. In Vulcan7, for example, you can tag leads by response type (hostile, warm, call-back later, etc.). Build micro-lists for targeted follow-up campaigns.
- Track original listing agents. If a home expired under the same agent 2–3 times, it’s a huge opening for you to show how your strategy is different.
Out-of-the-Box Strategy:
Reverse-engineer seller motivation by matching their old listing to public tax records. If they bought the home within the last 3–5 years, they likely still have emotional or financial ties. Tailor your message to that psychology:
“It looks like you bought just a few years ago—this market may still help you walk away with equity if we act strategically.”
Espresso Agent (The Nurture Machine)
What it is:
Similar to Redx/Vulcan7, but with better CRM integration and long-term follow-up tools—great for building a pipeline over time, not just hitting the phones.
Common Mistake:
Agents use it like a call list and ignore the drip marketing tools. That’s a waste. Espresso shines when you play the long game.
Insider Tips:
- Set up property-specific drip campaigns. These outperform generic newsletters. Example: “Here’s how 3 homes in your neighborhood sold after failing the first time.”
- Use video voicemails and personalized email intros. Espresso supports media—use it. A 45-second video saying, “I studied your last listing and have 3 ideas to improve results,” will destroy generic agent calls in terms of response.
- Pair with a CMA follow-up. After the initial outreach, send a mini-CMA with a one-liner: “This is how I’d reposition your property in today’s market.” Attach it to your second touch.
Out-of-the-Box Strategy:
Leverage the nurture tools to build seasonal re-engagement campaigns. I’d tag all expireds that pulled off the market in winter, then re-engage them in spring with:
"Many sellers pull their homes in winter, then forget to relist. Here’s why spring might finally get you the result you wanted."
Title Reps (The Untapped Goldmine)
What it is:
Title companies often offer custom lead data, pulled from public records, for agents they support. That includes expireds, absentee owners, and probate leads.
Common Mistake:
Agents treat title reps like glorified flyer printers. Meanwhile, the best reps can hand you a list of 60+ expireds from the last 90 days who never relisted.
Insider Tips:
- Request filtered lists. Ask for: expired listings within [ZIP], 30–180 days old, priced between [X–Y], where no new sale or listing is recorded.
- Cross-reference absentee owners. These often signal vacant properties or landlords ready to cash out. Huge for investors or flippers too.
- Build a co-marketing campaign. Partner with your title rep to create value-add guides (e.g., “Why Listings Fail & How to Get It Right the Second Time”) and mail them to older expireds. This adds credibility and gives your rep more incentive to support you.
Out-of-the-Box Strategy:
Ask your title rep for “agent failure” data—properties that expired under the same listing agent 2+ times. These sellers are primed for someone new. It’s a perfect door-opener:
"If your previous agent couldn’t sell this home after two tries, it might be time for a different strategy. Here’s what I’d do differently."
County Tax Records (For Hunters, Not Gatherers)
What it is:
Public access to ownership, lien status, transfer history, and property characteristics. All for free—but you’ll work for it.
Common Mistake:
Most agents think tax records are only useful for verifying mailing addresses. But they’re a full diagnostic tool for seller motivation and property complexity.
Insider Tips:
- Identify off-market expireds. Cross-reference expireds from 60+ days ago with tax records to find those who never relisted. Most agents never touch these.
- Look for equity clues. If the current owner bought 12–15 years ago and values have risen, they’re likely sitting on equity—and emotionally ready to sell.
- Use lien history. Heavy liens may explain pricing stubbornness. If there’s no room to reduce, that affects how you approach your conversation.
Out-of-the-Box Strategy:
Use tax data to preempt future expireds. Look for homes that listed 6–9 months ago and haven’t sold. Pull ownership info and prep your outreach for when they expire. You’ll be first in, and they’ll assume you just “happened to reach out”—when in fact, you’ve been planning for weeks.
FSBO & Withdrawn Listings (The Hidden Expireds)
What it is:
Properties that were either taken off-market (withdrawn) or never listed with an agent (FSBO), but often carry the same pain points as expireds.
Common Mistake:
Treating FSBOs like tire-kickers and ignoring withdrawn listings altogether. Both groups have often tried and failed—just not publicly.
Insider Tips:
- For Withdrawns: These are often quietly frustrated sellers. They might have yanked the listing for a vacation, a family issue, or just agent burnout. Reach out with empathy, not hard sales.
- For FSBOs: Don’t start by asking if they want to list. Start with help. I used to say: “I noticed you’re selling on your own—do you have a backup plan if it doesn’t sell by X date?” Then I’d offer a net sheet comparison for free.
Out-of-the-Box Strategy: Track FSBOs over time. I had a weekly FSBO tracker in my CRM. Every 2 weeks, I’d re-check Zillow, FB Marketplace, or Craigslist. If they were still up, I’d reach out again—but this time with a specific offer:
"Looks like you’ve been trying to sell for a month. If I could bring a buyer without requiring a full listing contract, would you be open to that?"
This gets your foot in the door—and 9 out of 10 times, they realize they’d rather list with someone competent than go it alone.
Phase 2: How to Qualify Expireds Like a Pro (Not a Pest)
Just because a listing expired doesn’t mean it’s worth your time. Sellers can be angry, unrealistic, unmotivated—or flat-out done.
You need a filter. Below is a qualification matrix I used with my team. Every lead gets rated across five categories. Anything scoring 4 out of 5 or higher? Worth pursuing.
Expired Listing Qualification Matrix
Criteria | Green Light (2 pts) | Yellow Light (1 pt) | Red Light (0 pts) |
Pricing | Within 5–10% of comps | Overpriced but not extreme | 20%+ over comps |
Photos & Marketing | Professional photos, but weak marketing | Amateur photos, unclear MLS remarks | Terrible photos, no staging, minimal effort |
Seller Type | Owner-occupied, local, responsive | Tenant-occupied or absentee owner | Unreachable, trust legally held or foreclosure pending |
Listing Age | Expired within last 7–30 days | 30–90 days | Over 90 days and relisted multiple times |
Motivation Indicators | Clear reason to move (job, downsizing, family need) | Somewhat motivated, not urgent | No stated reason or said they’re not planning to sell again |
Scoring System:
- 8–10 points: High-priority. Call, door knock, mail, and drip follow-up.
- 5–7 points: Nurture list. Stay in touch monthly, build rapport slowly.
- 0–4 points: Skip or archive. You’ll waste time and energy.
Using Google & Social to Pre-Qualify
Before you ever make that call, spend five minutes online. Here’s what I look for:
- Google their name + address: Has this person been involved in community events? Do they run a business? You might find news stories or associations that give you conversation hooks.
- LinkedIn: I once landed a listing by opening with: “I saw you’re in logistics—I used to help a FedEx exec sell their home here, and we ran into similar timing issues.”
- Facebook groups or Nextdoor: Especially in tight-knit neighborhoods, expireds may have already complained publicly about their experience. Learn what went wrong—then solve it.
How to Talk to Expired Listing Leads (Without Sounding Like Every Other Agent)
Let me be blunt: the biggest reason agents fail with expireds is because they sound like a script robot.
If your first words are “Hi, is this the homeowner?” or “I noticed your home came off the market…,” you’re already in the mental spam folder.
What you need instead is a humanized, layered approach to expired listings scripts that:
- Disarms their defensiveness,
- Establishes immediate credibility, and
- Opens a real conversation (not a pitch).
Let’s break this into formats: Calls, Voicemails, Texts, and Door Knocks.
Cold Calls for Expired Listings (With Scripts) (How to Open, Qualify, and Book in 3 Minutes)
Every expired listing call I made followed a simple arc:
Opener → Personalization → Discovery → Positioning → Ask
Here’s the call script framework I used, with tweaks based on experience:
Opener:
“Hi [Seller’s Name], this is [Your Name] with [Your Brokerage]. I know you probably got a hundred calls today, so I’ll keep this super quick—can I ask you just one thing about your property?”
That phrasing disarms them. You’re not pitching, you’re asking for permission.
Personalization:
“I was reviewing the listing photos and noticed [insert something specific: ‘the backyard looked amazing,’ or ‘the kitchen was clearly renovated recently’]—was that a big selling point for you when you bought it?”
Now you’re showing you’ve done your homework. This separates you instantly from 90% of agents.
Discovery:
“What do you think went wrong the first time around? I’ve seen a few homes like yours that didn’t get the right marketing push—was it mostly lack of showings or just no real offers?”
Here’s where they open up—and you listen. No pitching yet.
Positioning:
“Got it. Well, I’ve helped several clients in the same spot—homes that didn’t sell the first time because the story wasn’t told right. I’d love to show you what I’d do differently, no pressure.”
Ask for Appointment:
“Would it be crazy to take 10–15 minutes sometime this week, just to walk you through my strategy?”
Voicemails That Actually Get Returned
Most agents leave long, desperate voicemails. Here’s a better structure:
“Hi [First Name], this is [Your Name] with [Brokerage]. I saw your property came off the market recently, and I had three specific ideas for repositioning it that I think you might find helpful. I’ll follow up by text, but feel free to call me at [Number]. Again, that’s [Name] with [Brokerage]—looking forward to connecting.”
Why it works: It’s specific, curiosity-driven, and you offer value before asking for time.
Text Messages That Get Replies
Texts are gold for second and third touches. Here are a few that worked for me:
Scenario | Text Message Template |
After voicemail | “Hey [Name], it’s [Your Name]. I just left you a quick message about your property that came off the market. I’ve got some thoughts that might help—mind if I send them over?” |
Low pressure, high value | “Saw your listing came off the market. I’m not calling to list it—I just helped another owner nearby who went through the same thing. Can I send you what worked for them?” |
Reengagement (2+ weeks after no contact) | “Following up from last month—any change in plans regarding the home? I’ve had a few buyers looking in your area and wanted to check in.” |
Important: Never pitch by text. Use it to earn permission to talk.
Door Knocking (When to Do It and How to Win Face-to-Face)
Face-to-face works best for:
- High-value expireds (e.g., $800K+ in hot zip codes)
- Properties that expired 30–60 days ago and weren’t relisted
- Neighborhoods you’re farming anyway
Here’s what I bring:
- A pre-listing packet with a one-page CMA, case study from a nearby success, and a custom marketing plan outline
- A hand-addressed envelope (looks personal)
- My expired-specific flyer: “Why Homes Don’t Sell (and What I Do Differently)”
What I say at the door:
“Hi, I’m [Your Name]. I live/work nearby and noticed your property came off the market recently. I’ve sold a few homes in this area that didn’t move the first time, and I just wanted to drop off some ideas. No pressure to chat now—this is just something for you to look over.”
Most agents come in pitching. You show up providing insight. That’s the difference.
Expired Listing Postcards (The Secret Weapon That Works While You Sleep)
What it is:
Direct mail targeted specifically at homeowners whose listings recently expired or were withdrawn. A well-crafted postcard can cut through the noise and get you on the kitchen table—even if the seller hasn’t returned a single call.
Common Mistake:
Sending generic, self-centered marketing pieces like “Your Home Didn’t Sell—Call Me!” with zero personality, insight, or positioning.
Design and Messaging Principles
- Lead with insight, not ego. Your card should say, “Here’s why your home didn’t sell, and what I would’ve done differently.”
Not: “I’m #1 in my office.” - Make it feel personal—even if it’s not. Use hand-addressed envelopes or variable data printing (names, property type, price) to create the illusion of customization.
- Keep it one idea per card. Avoid trying to cram your whole resume onto a 5×7. Pick one hook and build the message around it.
Best Performing Expired Postcard Themes I’ve Used:
Postcard Theme | Core Message | Why It Works |
“3 Reasons Your Home Didn’t Sell” | Quick, curiosity-driven list of what went wrong (pricing, photos, agent effort). | Seller is already asking this in their head—you give them answers. |
“Before You Relist, Read This” | Share a checklist or free guide (“7 Things to Do Differently Before Going Back on the Market”). | Establishes authority and positions you as a strategist. |
“We Sold What Others Couldn’t” | Case study from a similar expired that you listed and sold. Include photo + address. | Proof over promises. Nothing beats social proof. |
“A Fresh Start for [Address]” | Hyper-personalized headline with home’s actual street name. “A Fresh Start for 28 Carson Way.” | Makes it feel like the message was made just for them. |
“No Listing Contract? No Problem.” | Offer a 30-day marketing plan with no long-term commitment. | Reduces risk. Sellers burned by agents love this offer. |
Out-of-the-Box Strategy: The 3-Card Expired Mail Campaign
Most agents drop a single postcard and move on. I run a 3-step campaign that builds momentum:
- Card 1: “Here’s What Went Wrong”
Lead with diagnostic insight. Show you understand why their home didn’t sell. - Card 2 (1 week later): “How I’d Fix It”
Include a teaser version of your marketing plan, rebranding ideas, or a new pricing angle. - Card 3 (Week 3): “Let’s Talk Numbers”
Send a mini-CMA snapshot comparing their home to recently solds, with a call-to-action: “Let’s run the numbers together and see what’s possible.”
Add a QR code to each that links to a video message or landing page for tracking.
How to Get Expired Listings: Follow-Up Systems That Actually Win Sellers Over
Let me be clear: most expired listings are won in the follow-up. Not the first call. Not the first postcard. Not even the first door knock.
You’ll win these sellers the fifth time you show up with something valuable—when every other agent has given up or moved on.
But this only works if you have a structured system.
Let’s break down what that system looks like: how to tag leads, how often to follow up, what to send, and how to close without chasing.
Step 1: Set Up Your CRM for Expireds
First, stop using sticky notes, spreadsheets, or your inbox to track leads.
You need to work from a CRM that can:
- Segment leads by tag
- Trigger automations based on status
- Track every interaction across phone, email, text, and mail
Recommended CRM Tags for Expireds:
Tag Name | Purpose |
Expired – New | Pulled within past 7 days. High urgency. |
Expired – Warm | Has responded. Some interest or open-ended. |
Expired – Cold | Unresponsive or not ready to relist yet. |
Expired – Nurture | Delayed interest (3–6 months out). Still viable. |
Expired – Not a Fit | Unqualified. Price/staging/attitude issues. |
Expired – Reached Out | You’ve sent a postcard, text, or voicemail. No reply yet. |
Expired – Appointment Set | Obvious. Don’t lose this one. |
Add notes religiously. Every conversation, every pain point, every “call me in 3 weeks.” This is how you build context and tailor follow-up.
Step 2: Build a Follow-Up Cadence That Doesn’t Feel Like Spam
Here’s a system I used to consistently convert expireds without annoying them.
First 14 Days (High Frequency, High Value)
Day | Channel | Action |
1 | Phone | Call with human-first script. If no answer, leave voicemail. |
1 | Text | Send follow-up text referencing voicemail. |
2 | Short intro email with 3 reasons homes fail + offer to meet. | |
3 | Deliver/postcard: “3 Reasons Your Home Didn’t Sell” | |
6 | Phone | Second call attempt. No voicemail this time. |
7 | Send mini CMA + simple note: “What your home could sell for now.” | |
10 | Text | Casual check-in: “Still planning to stay put for now?” |
14 | Case study of similar home you sold (before/after strategy). |
At this point, you’ve made 8 touches in 14 days, and each one added insight or value. That’s how you stay top-of-mind without being annoying.
Step 3: Transition to a Long-Term Nurture System
If they still haven’t responded, don’t stop—just shift gears.
Month 1–3 (Mid-Frequency, High Relevance)
Frequency | Channel | Type of Content |
Bi-weekly | Educational content (e.g., “5 Mistakes Sellers Make Relisting Too Soon”) | |
Monthly | Postcard or letter with value (“Success Story: Home Sold in 14 Days After Expiring”) | |
Monthly | Phone/Text | Friendly check-in or local market update offer |
Every 60 days | Video Email | Personalized “check-in” video with market update, idea, or quick win |
Every touch must feel intentional. Don’t ask, “Are you ready to list?” Instead ask:
- “Has your situation changed at all since we last connected?”
- “I noticed another home in your neighborhood just sold—would it help to compare that sale to your home?”
- “Would you like me to keep you updated if the market shifts this fall?”
Step 4: Automate Without Sounding Automated
Your CRM should support conditional logic and behavioral triggers. Here’s what that looks like in action:
Trigger | Action |
Lead opens your email but doesn’t respond | Trigger follow-up call task 24 hours later |
Lead clicks your CMA link | Send “Let’s run the numbers together” email |
Lead doesn’t engage after 30 days | Move to “Nurture” tag + enroll in monthly drip |
Use merge fields for property address, first name, and even price points to keep messages feeling one-to-one—even if they’re being sent in batches.
Step 5: Know When to Push—and When to Pause
Here’s where judgment and experience matter.
Push when:
- They’ve re-engaged in any way (clicked, replied, watched a video)
- A home in their neighborhood just sold
- You’ve adjusted your market strategy and want to reintroduce it
Pause or slow down when:
- They’ve explicitly said “not ready” or “not selling”
- The tone of the market shifts dramatically (e.g., sudden rate hikes or inventory floods)
Set a 3–6 month “reactivation” reminder for these leads. Often, expireds re-enter the market after a season—or when their situation changes.
Final Thought: Follow-Up Is Where the Money Is
I’ve had expireds call me six months after I first reached out. They’d saved my postcard. Remembered my voicemail. Forwarded my email to their spouse.
You can’t fake follow-up. You either build a system that stays top-of-mind without being a nuisance, or you lose to the agent who does.
